What type of daggers do you collect?

The Thicket · Joined: 17 Jul 2007 Posts: 86 Location: Right Here.

I think this can get the ball rolling a bit, what do you guys collect, Army Daggers, Luftwaffe daggers< SS, SA, etc.

And why do you all collect that type dagger?

How long have you all been collecting?

feldwebel · Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Posts: 21

Daggers are my specific interest although I do have other items that are mostly for enhancing the display of them. I have been collecting for 5 years now and got into it a bit late at 45. i used to collect the abundant british militaria when I was a kid but it all got forgotten when I discovered girls and beer Laughing

I have an appreciation of all the types really and did not have a particular favourite to begin with. I started with an RZM NSKK and throughout my very early collecting considered the political daggers to be particularly nice.

I by no means have a large collection and there are many more that I do not have than those that I do so I will necessarily limit my choice of top pieces to those in my posession. 1st luft`s are a fabulous dagger. if you can get one in good condition they are truly awesome in the hand with a real quality about them. The navy daggers are also exquisite in their quality. if you have never had a DRK officers dagger in your hand then they will be a surprise and are IMO vastly under apprciated! i have recently decided that i needed to be more focused on my collecting and have opted to concentrate on heer daggers. This decision although partly influenced by economic factors was mainly arrived at by the abundant variation in this type and my growing appreciation. I should perhaps also enjoy more than the one SA that I have but IMO they are vastly over hyped at this time and accordingly over priced for what is one of the most common pieces. Heer`s and 2nd luft`s are a good bet right now for new collectors and those of average means and 1st lufts are probably the best deal you can get for your money. JMO

The Thicket · Joined: 17 Jul 2007 Posts: 86 Location: Right Here.

Great responce, I agree with you on many points, Though I have always felt that early SA daggers were way underrated, saddly we now have a lot of info that is a bit askew on these so its added a wierd tone to the market.
As in its obvious that no one has the true amounts of numbers of production, nor can one say that a certian maker only used one group marking.

Anyway I agree with you on Army daggers as there are really many unique styles of them about. The early ones seem to be the best as far as base materials but as well can show the flaws of early production issues. Again something that sets them apart for the mix of later made daggers.

I have always liked Luftwaffe daggers, and feel that all Luftwaffe items are way underpriced.

daggernut · Joined: 10 Jul 2007 Posts: 12

''I have always liked Luftwaffe daggers, and feel that all Luftwaffe items are way underpriced.''

You're letting your personal preference get in the way of your judgement. Like everything in this hobby, and elsewhere else, price is determined by the law of supply and demand. The fact is that they made a lot of Luft daggers and most of them were never or seldom worn. Hence, a large supply relatively speaking. Don't get too carried away or it can cost you.

The Thicket · Joined: 17 Jul 2007 Posts: 86 Location: Right Here.

Ok, lets see if I have this striaght, I am not allowed to have an opinion?

So then why dose one collect again? As far s as I can grasp, one collects what one likes, is it not? Why would that be construed as getting carried away?

What is it you like; as thats what this thread is all about -- surly you have something that compells you to amass.. What might that be?

daggernut · Joined: 10 Jul 2007 Posts: 12

My response to your post was intended to be a friendly warning. Sorry I offended you. Just didn't want you to let your passion get in the way of your judgement. As to the type of edged weapons I collect, I specialize in the blades made to scrape bird doody from the insides of Black Forest cuckoo clocks.

buckles · Joined: 21 Jul 2007 Posts: 2

Ha! Good one daggernut!

feldwebel · Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Posts: 21

How unfortunate to see what had the potential of a serious topic here degenerate.

Combat Relics · Joined: 14 Jul 2007 Posts: 149

My thing has always been the standard pattern military and SS daggers. I avoided the inscribed, presentation, damascus prototype, one of a kind rarities for several reasons. First was availability, they may have been around, but one Rolls Royce or 20 Chevy Camaros? Price was another factor.
There were few of the rare ones to examine and no fully reliable referances when I started. Many of the rare things I saw, were questionable as to who put the inscription on the blade and when. Even in the 1960's there were plenty of shaky daggers around.

I once bought an Army with a green leather covered scabbard and handle for $10. Imagine my disgust when it turned out not to be an army but a borderguard's dagger! I also got a Luftwaffe 2nd Model with a black grip and wondered what the heck it was. Oh well I only had $20 in it so I liked it anyway.
But those were flukes.
,
So standard Luft, Army, and Navy as well as the SS were the ones I studied, and gathered. I figured that these were the most likely to be in demand by almost any potential purchaser, and affordable to them, should I get in a pickle for some fast cash!

They were common enough to be able to find and buy nicer examples, and the resale price if I were to part with them would be in the reach of most collectors.

I missed the whole 'one of every type in mint condition' concept, that seems to have become the focus of many blade collectors. Before the 'INVESTMENT BANKER' mentality took over, and it was still pretty much a hobby. I simply collected what I liked, and thought would be what other collectors would want too.

My personal philosophy is like what art people advise. Collect what you like/love, not what you think might make you a lot of profit.

While these Armys and Lufts may have been common then, they certainly are bringing good money if in premium condition today. Hangars and knots are performing well too.

Condition is very important, and it seems that since all the statements like 'very rare maker' or 'rare in silver plated finish' or 'deluxe fine detailing' etc. by authors, seem to have convinced people that one variant is more desirable than another.

I can understand why a 100% firegilt finish, on a hammered scabbard orange grip, mint Navy dagger would be at a premium. The friggin thing is gorgeous! Also, a genuine Ivory grip on an Army should command more money than plastic, this is actual premium materials and the workmanship may be better as well.

However I have a mint/new condition wartime Zinc Army that has been Grey since the day it was made. I like it as much as any standard silver plated example from another maker which is also in minty condition.

Maybe due to the plethora of makers of SA daggers, there is some reason to price a certain maker higher, but I cannot say what factor, other than less numbers manufactured, would be any major difference. Maybe a sexier maker mark?

Well if someone wants to pay a lot more for shiny that is up to them! It is like early war versus late war, in a lot of respects. Some guys are bonkers over the latest crudest weapons and gear they can find. Some like the finest tailored pre-war quality. Personal focus and preference, I imagine.

While reading some of the posts on this thread it has occurred to me that maybe some friendly advice would help. At least I hope so ...

Guys lets think about what we are saying to each other and try to make our efforts be like a friendly discussion among friends. Maybe write it out in notepad, and edit and rewrite until you have a little document that you believe is worth reading.

Complete relevant thoughts and personal insights will go a long way to making this a community. We should make an earnest effort not to argue impolitely, or respond with attitude. Lets assume the other guy is just like us, a friendly guy who like friends. If we are careful with what we write, we will engender a better environment as we develop the style of our forum.

While other forums have plenty of polite exchanges on them, many threads start to degrade into insults, accusations, and acrimony. While it may make one type of person feel superior to unload on others, it really doesn't help the culture of the community. In fact if we quarrel and try to assert just to try and overpower other opinions, nobody 'wins'.

When, for instance, was the last time your wife told you that you were totally wrong about a position you took on a subject, and you believed she knew what she was talking about?

So lets not get hasty and offended or insult each other. I am reasonably sure we all can get along, and learn a lot together.

The Thicket · Joined: 17 Jul 2007 Posts: 86 Location: Right Here.

#1 Seller, Again strong words of wisdom. Saddly the hobby has been twisted over the last number of years due inpart to on line forums. As well as the advent of the as you noted the Banker Collector, as well as the dealers who play the fiddle to such collectors delight.

On that note lets see if we can forge ahead with what may be perhaps a valuable thread in the long run.

alton · Joined: 30 Aug 2007 Posts: 4

''How unfortunate to see what had the potential of a serious topic here degenerate''

Don't take things so serious. A little humor never hurt anyone. Actually I kind of liked the cuckoo clock bit!

maxwell · Joined: 21 Jul 2007 Posts: 6

''How unfortunate to see what had the potential of a serious topic here degenerate''

I wouldn't get too upset. Forums tend to be a free-for-all and anything might be said and a thread might lead anywhere. It's part of the game and what makes a forum fun.

As to daggers, I collect SAs by makers, among other things, and thought I had some rare ones. I just saw the article on SA dagger trademarks in the blog and it showed me how, what I thought was rare, is only scarce at best. It seems there are an awful lot of them out there with different makers. So much for trying to get one of each! I think I'll concentrate on other areas of collecting for a while. Laughing

feldwebel · Joined: 28 Jul 2007 Posts: 21

Perhaps I am a little uptight but this is a new forum & it takes time to get to know people & some are easily put off.
Maxwell if you want to collect SA`s by maker, then like me you are about 5 years too late. the prices have escalated well beyond their realistic value & many in the hobby have got tunnel vision today where they`re concerned. Hyped beyond all reason. You are right to pass on them for now IMO.

Combat Relics · Joined: 14 Jul 2007 Posts: 149

I do not think that 'upset' is a good destination for a thread.

Forums elsewhere, do tend to be a free for all, for folks who do not think before they speak, do not consider the reasons they are there, and what the effect of their comments may be for the other participants of the forum.

Is being RIGHT, the only consideration? If you believe that, ask any married guy how many times after an argument his wife has admitted he was right.

Diplomacy is a far better trait to display here.

I do not see it as a place to have a showdown or an argument!
Check out this thread at another forum and read how it descends into chaos because 2 people do not watch what they are saying to each other. They prefer instead to only incite.

If this example doesn't convince you that things are getting out of hand, nothing will!

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/showthread.php?t=229391&amp;amp;page=2&amp;amp;highlight=thuringen

What a waste of time and effort. It left nobody feeling good about participation.

In the hobby today it seems increasingly harder each year to find things 'FUN'.

Prices though actually pretty fair, are often beyond an average wage earners means. That situation is nothing new, our discretionary funds are sought by every sort of marketer in this economy.

Still, we choose what we wish to invest in, and we seek out the items we desire, whether it is daggers or comic books. To justify the cost, knowledge of a lot of factors can assuage our fears. Also knowledge can help us avoid mistakes in many areas. Not the least of which are, price for condition, originality, rarity, and potential for resale.

I believe the primary purpose of this forum environment is to help us to concentrate and distill knowledge. It seems to me that in a market where so many negative dynamics exist, we need all the accurate information we can acquire.

One thing I notice here is that VERY FEW postings, are from guys who will not put forth the effort to know an item is original or not.
That is a good sign that people here are trying to educate themselves. Doing research before letting your ignorance show is a smart move.

I read other forums occasionally. Pictures and links to the worst looking pieces of fake garbage are posted along with the 'Is this real? Can you guys help me out with your expertise, please?' Types of comments.

Those guys are already in big trouble in this field. It is one thing to ask about specific details and features etc. of a fine looking item that is likely real or a super fake needing to be vetted. It is another to let people know that you do not have the basic knowledge of the field of collecting.

A guy like that would be better off to spend a year or two, in Very intensive study. I would suggest too that if he wants to collect, only to buy common, obviously original, and rather inexpensive items,.. while he learns what to look for when it comes to those rare and expensive rarities that we all crave, and that have been heavily replicated.

Der Staffel · Joined: 14 Sep 2007 Posts: 4

Nr1Seller has made some very good observations in his posts. However, I believe he thinks too much of the new collector. What I mean is that he expects the newbie to act like an veteran. I think it is better to ask a ''stupid'' question than to stay ingorant. Remember, as they say on SOUTHPARK, ''There are no stupid questions, just stupid people''. I don't think we should discourage anyone from asking a question about anything they are not sure about. How else can they aquire knowledge? If they are not asking the questions here, they will be asking collector friends or strangers at the gun show. What's the difference?

As to showing your ignorance-- If you really want to show your ignorance, be quite, don't ask any questions, and get ripped off!

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